[Marcin_G]

Tak się składa że dostałem od Benta dwie wiadomości w których pisze o przekazaniu komputerów. Ja niestety z angielskiego to jestem noga i o ile potrafię zrozumieć słowo pisane, o tyle już z odpisaniem jest poważny problem. Na te dwie wiadomości odpowiedź pisała znajoma, ale głupio mi ją ciągle prosić o tłumaczenia. Napisałem gościowi że u mnie z angielskim cienko, mimo to znowu otrzymałem wiadomość taką jak powyżej. Przypadkiem Krokowa leży parę kilometrów od Rumi, tylko nie wiem czy jest sens zainteresowania się tą sprawą. Jeżeli by się okazało że te komputery są w miarę "młode" (chociaż z tekstu wynika coś innego) to może bym pomęczył znajomą o tłumaczenia. Jak myślicie, warto się tym zająć?

[_sys]

Jeżeli szkoły potrzebują tych komputerów to taki szlachetny wolontariat . Dowiedz się jakie to komputerki, będzie łatwiej. No i oczywiście jak jest jakiekolwiek zainteresowanie tymi komputerami ze strony szkół.

[Bent Paradis]

How old is first of all a question about receiving.
I have a need - like the schools have a need.

What exactly would You like us to do? Have you found any school that is interested in rest of computers. How old are these computers.
Even polish municipal schools could not be interested in very old machines.

That is not correct - both KROkova and a school in Orunia is shoing the facts ! (BUT the school in Orunia was changed from podstawova to gymnaszium) - and especially outsite the cities in the country site. I have seen the computer rooms that sometimes even don't exist.
Primitively said: I do not give away G3 maschines to somebody who greedy don't CO-operate at all. Is that not fair :?: That is the problem = everybody wants the newer PowerMac for themselves (ego use = not paying or doing anything themselves).


Primary schools (podstawova) often have computer Lab and don't understand why should they accept the gift.

If somebody
1. receive the computers
2. are USING them untill next delivery of better/ newer maschines3. then the oldest maschines in the school could be given to other school classes (lower level = beginners = or reused in some way)
4. this kind of CO-operation means that I can / want newer maschines here in Denmark OR I STOP EVERYTHING AND THROUGH EVEN THE G3 PowerMac to the Danish recycling system = stoping the whole project. SIMPLY.

So simple is everything.

Some schools could CO-operate IF it is not too strange for them - through the municipal for exsamle (one way).

The problem is rather what to put into the computers (usefull software).
To beginners (children in the age of 6 - 10 years operating system 7.53 in Polish is useful - later system 9.1 in English would be more natural.

Sory to tell that I have been working with children and Macintosh computers the last 18 years - daily !.


Another answer:
"10 pentium computers ONLY to 500 pupils in a gymnazium i Poland" is that what Macintosh specialists and users prefere to be used in Poland ?. Your answer sound like YEAS - but is it really the thruth :?:





_________________

[janek]

Don't be sorry, we know much about Polish education system. I suppose the main problem is with the people (teachers from schools) who don't wanna hold all the logistic and formal problems connected with your gift. But I know the school wich will be very interested in your proposition. It is a fine art collage from my city (Lodz). My father is a teacher (I graduated few years ago), and I can get a contact with director to discuss all the problems. But you must tell me what conditions school must fill to get your gift. We must know if there is transport fee, or other formal problems connected with that Best regards Janek

[Bent Paradis]

Answer to:

(From Marcin G)

Hi.
My wife is a teacher in class level 0-3 (children in the age of 6-10). The school she works has already have computer studio based on PC comp. I'm afraid that school's managament won't be an interest in unknown comp. even for free. But I can ask if You wont.

I'm wondering over what you said about CO-OPERATION and THE PAYMENT. I don't know whether I understood corectly: it is possible that there will be more computer deliver - more than once? In this case it one should find more, new interested schools??? - what about paymant in thise case?

And what about "CO-OPERATION"? Person who will start it with you will be obligated to keep watching over this computers and relay them to another schools? Am I right?

I think there will be problem with schools interest because most of them has already have PC!

Tell me, please, more about your computers: which models and configuration?!

Excuse me for keeping you waiting to my answers but like I said I don't know English and I must asking "my" translator for help.

This masage was sent from my friend's mail box. Please don't use this adress!

Thanks
Marcin

Yeas, yeas and yeas.

But the Macintosh version is depending is a question about the childrens age (class) er experience of using computers, a question about the co-operation (team-work) with me, the teachers, the schools, my economic situation, AND VERY IMPORTENT how often and well we do co-operate (do function together).

I still have 4 Macintosh II CI but with 32 MB RAM insite each of them.
There are still some LC 475 and Quadra 650, Performa 6200 (with PowerMac processors), a lot of PowerMacintosh maschine upto and including PowerMac G3.
I want and wish in the future ONLY to get and deliver PowerMacintosh maschines. Within the next year I expect to receive somethging like 10 PowerMac G3.

BUT I AM SORRY TO TELL EVERYBODY that I have a brain and I want to use it = also in this project (now in year 10). I have been working with children and Macintosh computers for 18 years - BUT in Denmark. The situation is much more advanced with children here = I did start the process in 1986 when I got my first Macintosh.

When one municipal (KROkowa can arrive in Denmark and fill up the car and the trailor behind and pay the transportation to KROkowa with me insite for the purpose in Poland to chech the computers AFTER the transportation and installation in a school in podstawova school ONLY FOR THE AGE OF CHILDREN FROM 6 - 10 = then WHY SHOULD NOBODY ELSE IN POLAND BE AGAINST IT ?). The answer is very simple to anybody with a usefull brain.

It is the mainpart of the answer !.

With best wishes from
Bent Paradis

[ Dodano: 2005-07-28, 15:33 ]
Several years ago I did find a website for a school in the southpart of Lodz -
and I did send informations about the project.
THEY DID ASK FOR MACINTOSH COMPUTERS = but I did never get ANY answer - that is Poland !.
I 1996 I was is Lodz !.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Don't be sorry, we know much about Polish education system. I suppose the main problem is with the people (teachers from schools) who don't wanna hold all the logistic and formal problems connected with your gift.

But I know the school wich will be very interested in your proposition. It is a fine art collage from my city (Lodz). My father is a teacher (I graduated few years ago), and I can get a contact with director to discuss all the problems. But you must tell me what conditions school must fill to get your gift. We must know if there is transport fee, or other formal problems connected with that

Best regards

Janek

Some of the answers You got in my replay to Marcin G.

We must know if there is transport fee, or other formal problems connected with that.
THAT is the best in your question.

The Municipal and the school in Krokowa did arrange all transportation as mention above AND the were ready to pay for it.
The Municipal accepted to receive computers and pay their part BECAUSE the school dyrector didn't have money from the school to the purpose.

BUT the more important question is about the software BECAUSE there is only 2 polish system for free use (system 7.1 and 7.53). It means PowerMacs has to contain ENGLISH system for exsample 8.6 or system 9.1 = ENGLISH.
I suppose Polish children has to learn English after a sudden age. In Orunia (when the school was a podstawova) I did give English lessons about Denmark and E.U.. A local newspaper did show up and did afterward bring articles about it.
THAT WAS CO-OPERATION - and the contact teacher is still one of my good friends of caurse.

This is a part of the answer = point ONE.

Best wishes from Paradise

[ Dodano: 2005-08-12, 16:10 ]
:idea:
What about one stationary page with all translating word (polish > English) and showing the buttons ?.

Of caurse I am missing a lot of the texts meanings - but as a start-up !.

- from Paradise


[ Dodano: 2005-08-12, 16:25 ]
Hi again.

The school rooms with first and second classes have 2 - 3 Mac computers in every room.

The quistion arrising is: DO schools in Poland ONLY to have computers IN ONE ROOM = that is the old 10 years fasion european way !.
What do you do if ONE person HAVE TO write something or find something on the internet = your Polish answer is = everybody has to rush to the ONE computer room that is already occupied for the whole day !.


In the school - where I did spend 2 weeks with polish chrildren from the "Black Triangle" -
there is a "wagon with 50 notebooks". It means reservation here and now of this wagon and then move it to the class room that needs computers for the moment being.
I have been in some school classes several places in Poland - AND I know something about the situation in Denmark too.
Even several kindergardens in Denmark have computers TO THE CHILDREN !.
In one kindergarden the did have webcamera in activation ALL the day - so the parents could use the computer at work - for the purpose just to opserve the situation in the kindergarden. It did create a big debat = it is not going on any more.


[ Dodano: 2005-08-12, 16:29 ]
I wonder about Lodz.
There was a school (one of the biggest) in the south part of Lodz.
I did write to the school (perhaps 54 years ago now) because the school did want Macintosh computers.
:roll:

I did never get any reaction.
:cry:

[menelek]

Mr Paradise, please do not think in your - west european - logical way if you want to CO-OPERATE with polish schools. I can see you don't understand many many things. greetings

[Bent Paradis]

Well answered - BUT I as usual I am not giving up when I find something wrong. Logical things are logical whatever some other people are used to (old tradition / culture or whatever somebody) call it.[glow=violet:7d331768ec] THINK DIFFERENT do somebody mean !.[/glow:7d331768ec]

[shadow=red:7d331768ec]Can you tell me what to do (that is a part of my understanding of to the word CO-OPERATE)
IN POLAND ?.[/shadow:7d331768ec] Just sit down and wait for nothing ?.

Remember that I have been working on this project the last 10 years - not just to satisfy some few single persons thinking in own benefition here and now. That kind of people lives all over the world. :idea:

[glow=darkred:7d331768ec]Please explain yourself a little more - what you try to tell me. Sorry, that I sometimes answer shortly and not allways in details = that is me !. [/glow:7d331768ec] :x

If a school have 500 pupils and only have 10 computers and the people in the school wants more computers = why do the not react ?. Simple logic !. But they cann't use any from Denmark when they ARE FREE (= no reaction, of caurse - simple logic) !. :?:

Macintosh fans ?. What is that ?.
I could have got at least 1000 of PC computers FREE. But I am a Mac-fan ! = I decited only to thanks for Macintosh computers. Logic ?. :roll:

Macintosh computers before PowerMac are so simple to use that EVEN kindergarden children can find out how to use them !. Teachers in Poland ?. Hello man = who has a brain the kindergarten children or the teachers ?. -Please take it / me with a little humor (but in the same time serious), of caurse.

What is wrong in changing something in the head of people ?. Do you mean that it is dangerouse because then suddenly they could get into the situation to start thinking themself and in a new way ?. - OR ?. :twisted:

Thank or your reaction FIRST OF ALL.

Do you have some other surgestion ?. :?:

[menelek]

if you want to buy a car for your polish income you must work at least 3 years. And what, our parkings are full... Poles spend much more money than they earn. Much more. And what? Try to work in Poland and buy a house or flat. Good luck And about your present. Probably they are simply old and you want to spend them quickly. Probably you receive them from all kinds of institution and schools. There is a trouble with spending old computers, isn't it? What about ecology? Try to offer us very old cars in the same way. We'll probably refuse... Today internet needs rather faster machins then you offer. Look around. A few days ago I was in Uppsala (Sweden), visited probably the best library in that country. What I saw in the main hall? Only two old computers... Go to University of Olsztyn (Poland). Greetings

[Bent Paradis]

Thank you very much.

What you mention I do understand very well. I know enough to agree with you in general, of caurse.

BUT one of the hints is that 1.class children do NOT need to use internet. My friend in Rumia (who organized the agreement with the school in KROkowa) first of all has to go to the school to reorganize file pseudo-links on the Desk Top because the single child of that age have not yet got enough control of their motoric moovement of arms and fingers. He is a big LINUX (with big L) man but he could find out Macintosh computers in general (because he has knowledge of PC's).
In such a case it has nothing to do with internet and what you mentioned.
In another way (please keep in mind): when a gymnaszium has ONLY 10 Pentium 1 computers for 400 - 500 pupils THEN WHY do they not want PowerMacs BETTER or the same quality level ?. Whatever the life situation is in Poland - JUST NOW !.
What have their way of being have to do with a seriouse wish and attempt to change the situation to the better ?. In my mind they are rather trying to go bachward in changing = lack of change !.

For me THAT IS the starting point making things serious ---- >
LATER then (and now) I will ONLY get much better computers continuously !. That make sence to me - and in my mind to everybody !.

Some people and schools have nearly NOTHING ! - why do nobody THINK so far (psycho's :twisted: never do, of caurse = why behave like psycho's ?).

I do find my way a reasonable starting point for everybody :?:

Why focus on the hardware when the software in Polish is a much bigger problem.
Their are two official gratis (free) system software in Polish: system 7.01 and 7.53 - and NO further !.
When I do put software into the harddisk then it has to be legal or everything can be catastrophic. One municipal in Denmark did copy bought software unlegal on all compters in the municipal system. Microsoft did go into action and the municapal had to make aan appointment paying a TWO CIFFER MILLION amount of Danish Kroner as punishment not tio get a court case that would have ment many times more payment. The amount was never made official.

I means that I have to put ENGLISH Operating System in the better PowerMacs (that can NOT USE systems BEFORE 8) !.
And the software programs in Polish to the ordinairy (for exsample the youngest) pupils in podstawova's ?. I don't have any - simply :cry: !.

Where is the place SzadoLki in South Poland ?. I can not find in Danish Map /book ?.

I am now living in a new place and have to pay for storage out in town to have the PL computers somewhere. So I am extremely buzzy in my new living place. If you some day come to the Copenhagen area in Denmark then why not show up for a visit ?.
I have been a member of a peace organization the last 33 years as a functioning host for travelers from overall the globe (nearly). So I now how to handle such situations and I am used to do it.

Just now I am sitting in the data Club in my living area (the ownership organisation of my new place of living) = so I can take it more carmly = GRATIS / free use for nearly no money - they get very many PC computers totally gartis and inclusiv bussines big LaserPrinters and then free internet use and with at least 30 PC computers with full internet conection. The main persons in the commitee are computer specialists - of course. There are at least 20 computers more but not in use at the moment (just received). Yeas that is a part of Denmark too.

But I betetr stop this letter now -
hopping that some more people in Poland do react for more Macintosh's. The G3's are for later !.

The best wishes from
Bent Paradis

[ Dodano: 2005-08-31, 21:04 ]
Oh.

EXTRA:
I have been unemployed the last 5 years in Denmark - before that time I was head-hunted to jobs one after another = BUT I am not wanted because of my age (wied).

In the school in Orunia (MY first school delievery place) the school master and my contact teacher did sit together in the school master (dyrector)'s room. I was ask to take a job in the school (I was unemployed) though I am not an official teacher. I had to say no thanks because of the payment possability - AND I was informed quit well about the economic situation in Poland: unemployed %, income payment and the income for retired teachers etc.. My income in Denmark as an unemployed was much much better - and I would lose it !. But I would have surely like the work.

Hi.